Antonin Scalia: Constitution Doesn’t Prohibit Torture
[su_right_ad]Justice Antonin Scalia says as far as our Constitution is concerned, torture is permissible.
In an interview with Radio Television Suisse this week following the release of Senate Intelligence Committee’s CIA torture report, Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia said he doesn’t “think it’s so clear at all” that the U.S. Constitution prohibits torture, especially in the “ticking time bomb” scenarios so often cited by defenders of the “enhanced interrogation techniques.”
“Listen, I think it’s very facile for people to say, ‘Oh, torture is terrible,’” Scalia told the Swiss radio network. “You posit the situation where a person that you know for sure knows the location of a nuclear bomb that has been planted in Los Angeles and will kill millions of people. You think it’s an easy question? You think it’s clear that you cannot use extreme measures to get that information out of that person?”
“I don’t know what article of the Constitution that would contravene,” the conservative justice added in reference to the harsh treatment of terrorism suspects.[su_csky_ad]
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:05 pm
“cruel or unusual punishment”….
Maybe Scalia needs to re-read the constitution..
mea_mark December 13th, 2014 at 6:29 pm
If it’s not on Fox, he won’t get it. The right-wing paradigm is all he wants.
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:35 pm
Bingo Amigo~!
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:11 pm
Ticking time bomb scenario….
Only happens in TV or the Movies..
mea_mark December 13th, 2014 at 6:34 pm
What I want to know is, does Scalia give a a rats ass at all about what the rest of the world thinks about us? Does it matter at all? Or is it all about American exceptionalism and our embracing the constitution and dictating our will to the world?
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:37 pm
As we go after other countries over their “human rights violations”..
We ignore or cast off as “necessary” with our own..
mea_mark December 13th, 2014 at 6:46 pm
America is growing-up, but what have we become?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ9tahGn0IU
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:47 pm
Classic.
Turnin it up.
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 6:57 pm
America F-Yeah~!…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGQaH3-LK54
OldLefty December 13th, 2014 at 6:50 pm
They don’t call him, “Fat Tony the Fixer” for nothing.
Larry Schmitt December 13th, 2014 at 7:06 pm
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blogcdn.com%2Fwww.aoltv.com%2Fmedia%2F2006%2F07%2Ffattony200.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aoltv.com%2Ftag%2Ffat%2Btony%2F&h=248&w=200&tbnid=w04o7_lGBYAWZM%3A&zoom=1&docid=C9eg9WqWB3jHzM&ei=3dSMVJvNKvS1sQTm9oGoDA&tbm=isch&ved=0CDIQMygLMAs&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=2285&page=1&start=0&ndsp=32
arc99 December 13th, 2014 at 6:54 pm
Does the 8th amendment mean anything? Courts have determined that it does not prohibit the death penalty. Since capital punishment was common when the Constitution was ratified, I can believe that.
But it does not prevent torture either? As far as I know, torture was not at all common in the new nation known as the United States of America.
The salient question is, where is the moral line that we as a nation will never cross? In Scalia’s ticking bomb scenario, suppose we torture someone who we believe will provide information that can save millions of lives, but the suspect refuses to talk. Also suppose we know where his family is. We capture his elderly parents and torture them to death, forcing him to watch. Still he provides no information. We then turn to his wife, and torture her to death, forcing him to watch. Still he remains silent.
Finally, we start to torture his 5 year old daughter, forcing him to listen to her screams of agony. Exactly where do we stop in this ticking bomb scenario? Is there no moral boundary? Do we butcher the elderly, innocent people, and kindergarteners all in the name of “saving lives”? There must be a moral standard. I say that standard must be that the United States of America does not torture anyone. Period.
Guy Lauten December 13th, 2014 at 7:17 pm
Excellent derivation! Bravo, and thank you. Such an apt hypothetical! Why is there no one asking him these questions? Against my better judgement I must watch Chuck Toad tomorrow. Not sure how much of it I can get through. Thanks again.
burqa December 13th, 2014 at 10:53 pm
Exactly.
Who do we not torture?
We used to have bin Laden’s driver in custody.
How do we know he didn’t overhear plot planning if we don’t torture him?
How about a foot soldier in a unit bin Laden visited. How do we know he never walked by an open window and overheard the plot to nuke Chicago?
What about Limbaugh?
How do we know that Limbaugh never had a terrist over to the house for dinner and plotted nuking Los Angeles if we don’t torture Limbaugh to find out?
burqa December 13th, 2014 at 10:53 pm
Exactly.
Who do we not torture?
We used to have bin Laden’s driver in custody.
How do we know he didn’t overhear plot planning if we don’t torture him?
How about a foot soldier in a unit bin Laden visited. How do we know he never walked by an open window and overheard the plot to nuke Chicago?
What about Limbaugh?
How do we know that Limbaugh never had a terrist over to the house for dinner and plotted nuking Los Angeles if we don’t torture Limbaugh to find out?
KABoink_after_wingnut_hacker December 13th, 2014 at 7:04 pm
Of course torturers were executed for using waterboarding after WWI & WWII, buts it’s now just okie dokie for the US now. This bigoted and biased old wingnut should just shut his trap because the nonsense he spews is acceptable only to republicans, teabaggers, clansmen and hillbillies and the REST OF THE WORLD hears his shameful ignorance loud and clear.
Guy Lauten December 13th, 2014 at 7:04 pm
Eighth Amendment to the United States Constitution: Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.
Seems pretty cut-and-dried to me, but then I’m not a legal acrobat like Tony the Fixer. So I suppose his contention is that torture isn’t cruel and/or punishment? I don’t think there was an operational safe word during these escapades, so somebody’s freedom is being removed by force and made to suffer pain. Punishment? Smells like a duck, quacks like a duck…
And where is the recourse for the accused but innocent (you know, habeus corpus and all that crap) Or do we no longer do that?
tiredoftea December 13th, 2014 at 7:05 pm
“I don’t know what article of the Constitution that would contravene,”, such a scary statement from a supposed “Original Intent” scholar!
burqa December 13th, 2014 at 10:20 pm
Indeed.
Conservatives like to pretend they know something of American history and act as if they want what the Founding Fathers did.
The fact of the matter is, the 8th Amendment banning cruel and unusual punishment was written with the cruel and unusual punishment meted out by the British fresh in their minds.
It included, on their prison ships:
* Diet manipulation
* sleep deprivation
* confinement in tight quarters
* confinement in painful positions
* waterboarding.
Of course back then conservatives supported the redcoats, so it is hardly surprising they want to bring back torture.
The Geneva Conventions, U.S. Military Code of Justice, U.S. criminal Code and the Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment all ban torture.
Here are 7 cases of waterboarding prosecuted by the U.S.:
http://usiraq.procon.org/sourcefiles/background_information_waterboarding.pdf
tiredoftea December 13th, 2014 at 10:22 pm
Yeah, they just don’t like facts, do they? Especially when they conflict with their pre-conceived notions of justice in our democracy.
burqa December 13th, 2014 at 10:36 pm
I never thought I’d see a time in our country when any but a few fringe kooks would ever demand we torture prisoners as a national policy, but there you have it.
It appears they are trying to brand the GOP as “the torture party.”
It’s revolting to see pundits with large followings convince their followers that torture is something we need to do.
Then they appear in forums like this, thinking torture is just another political issue, like debating the earned income tax credit or something. The fact that they are endorsing TORTURE, OF ALL THINGS, escapes them because people like Limbaugh didn’t program them to be bugged about that.
And before we get too hoity-toity about it, keep in mind that human nature spans the political spectrum, so there are people on the Left just as susceptible to suggestion as those on the Right…
tiredoftea December 13th, 2014 at 10:44 pm
Over a decade of the drumbeat of hatred, fear and an unending war with little interest in questioning why leaves us in the sorry state we are in.
But, be careful about the equivalence of right and left. The left is ineffective and emasculated while the right is driven by fear and its self entitlement of having to be “exceptional” in the world’s eyes.
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 7:07 pm
USAF General Curtis LeMay…
Killing Japanese didn’t bother me very much at that time… I suppose if I had
lost the war, I would have been tried as a war criminal.
rg9rts December 15th, 2014 at 7:31 am
SAC trained killer here
StoneyCurtisll December 17th, 2014 at 12:01 pm
Thanks for your service..(and not having to go through with your training)..:)
rg9rts December 17th, 2014 at 12:32 pm
We had emblems with the SAC logo on our vehicles.. The base closest to my home was a MAC base…Had to get one more shot before going overseas …As IO approached the gate the AP lost it…I got saluted thee whole 9 yards…the SAC trained killers was just a smoke screen and total BS…LOL a left over from LeMay
StoneyCurtisll December 17th, 2014 at 12:54 pm
From the movie Dr. Strangelove..
Attack on SAC Command..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPb_E_bR6oA
rg9rts December 17th, 2014 at 1:12 pm
Here you go…the NEWEST B 52 is the I model manufactured in………1957 ….Like most things military …they never hold up well to close examination …well the SR 71 did
neworleans878 December 13th, 2014 at 7:16 pm
It really annoys me how torture has become “enhanced interrogation”.
If you’re so f*cking gung-ho for it, stand up and be proud! Call it what it is!
TORTURE!!!
uzza December 13th, 2014 at 7:26 pm
StoneyCurtisll December 13th, 2014 at 8:09 pm
Why do they hate us?..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A6Zg670mqc
John_St_John December 14th, 2014 at 12:50 pm
Thank you for the video share StoneyCurtisII put it to good use already.
pundit456 December 13th, 2014 at 7:40 pm
Similarly, Mr Scalia, there is no constitutional article which mandates separation of church and state, or anything to that effect. If you advocate constraint by the US Constitution, you must also acknowledge that the practice of imposing separation of church and state has no constitutional founding.
Suzanne McFly December 13th, 2014 at 8:11 pm
Nothing like stretching the “truth”, nuclear bomb in Los Angeles? Really? Friggin’ drama queens.
burqa December 13th, 2014 at 10:28 pm
Indeed.
Somehow they think a prisoner who is hallucinating (one of the things results of the torture listed in the torture report) will give accurate info.
Notice Scalia and no one on the Right cites the best experts – profeessional interrogators on the subject.
I don’t have that problem.
Here is a selection from page 243 of FEAR UP HARSH An Army Interrogator’s Dark Journey Through Iraq, by Tony Lagournis (NAL Caliber, 2008):
“I spoke to Joe Navarro, a retired FBI agent and an expert in the field of interrogation. Joe has had great success in gathering intelligence during interrogations and interviews without the use of torture. He outlined four main reasons why torture is ineffective. First, talk can’t be confused with truth. A torture victim will say anything, true or false, to get the pain to stop. Second, the stress pain creates confuses the subject and he simply can’t remember details well enough to produce good intelligence. Third, the torture subject may die or go into shock, in which case no information can be obtained from him. Finally, and perhaps most compelling, the torture victim, if he tells the interrogator anything at all, is likely to give one piece of information, or very little information, whereas a cooperative subject will talk and continue talking. Joe added that he believes that torture strengthens the resolve of the detainee, citing Senator John McCain, who, after having his shoulder torn from its socket by interrogators in Vietnam, was more determined than ever to keep his silence.”
rg9rts December 15th, 2014 at 7:30 am
Whadda ya want he’s from Long Island…
tracey marie December 13th, 2014 at 10:21 pm
Except our laws and treaties say otherwise old man. Many have been charged, tried and convicted for doing the same to American soldiers. Shut up, sit down and die
fancypants December 14th, 2014 at 3:19 am
Antonin Scalia: Constitution Doesn’t Prohibit Torture
————————————————–
Relax judge We have some questions for you..
John_St_John December 14th, 2014 at 11:52 am
Give me 12 hours with this son of a bitch and not only will he be decrying the use of torture, he will also be crying about the loss of his eyes, nose, lips, fingers, toes, facial skin and his Cheney. Or as so aptly put in the Princess Bride.
Prince Humperdinck: First things first, to the death.
Westley: No. To the pain.
Prince Humperdinck: I don’t think I’m quite familiar with that phrase.
Westley: I’ll explain and I’ll use small words so that you’ll be sure to understand, you warthog faced buffoon.
Prince Humperdinck: That may be the first time in my life a man has dared insult me.
Westley: It won’t be the last. To the pain means the first thing you will lose will be your feet below the ankles. Then your hands at the wrists. Next your nose.
Prince Humperdinck: And then my tongue I suppose, I killed you too quickly the last time. A mistake I don’t mean to duplicate tonight.
Westley: I wasn’t finished. The next thing you will lose will be your left eye followed by your right.
Prince Humperdinck: And then my ears, I understand let’s get on with it.
Westley: WRONG. Your ears you keep and I’ll tell you why. So that every shriek of every child at seeing your hideousness will be yours to cherish. Every babe that weeps at your approach, every woman who cries out, “Dear God! What is that thing,” will echo in your perfect ears. That is what to the pain means. It means I leave you in anguish, wallowing in freakish misery forever.
Prince Humperdinck: I think you’re bluffing.
Westley: It’s possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It’s conceivable, you miserable, vomitous mass, that I’m only lying here because I lack the strength to stand. But, then again… perhaps I have the strength after all.
[slowly rises and points sword directly at the prince]
Westley: DROP… YOUR… SWORD!
Prince Humperdinck: [Humperdinck’s mouth hangs open, drops sword to floor]
rg9rts December 15th, 2014 at 7:28 am
Human decency dictates that torture is at the least immoral.. Scalia doesn’t understand that concept being from Long Island home of the notorious humanitarian Peter King
AnthonyLook December 15th, 2014 at 12:56 pm
A Foxtard Supreme Court Justice.